Senses Initiated Lucid Dream Ssild

So I've tried this method for about two days in a row, and I like it very much so far Things I've noticed while using SSILD -Dream recall skyrockets -I get annoyed because the technique is too suddle(I like to expect something will happen) -I have a lot of trouble falling asleep after cycles and wbtb(I frequently check for FA's) -Although it's been taking a while to fall alseep I wake up feeling rested anyway Some thoughts I will continue with this technique because I haven't had much luck with the other techniques and my dream recall has been rather bad lately, and SSILD has improved that, It strange how this technique works and I notice how it's described as "setting off a time bomb, to go off in your dream" in the updated guide I don't really understand that quote and was hoping for some clearification, but I do believe this could be a great helping hand technique for beginners and I appreciate any input or advice from fellow SSILDers Thanks, -EmptyBucket

Originally Posted by EmptyBucket: So I've tried this method for about two days in a row, and I like it very much so far Things I've noticed while using SSILD -Dream recall skyrockets -I get annoyed because the technique is too suddle(I like to expect something will happen) -I have a lot of trouble falling asleep after cycles and wbtb(I frequently check for FA's) -Although it's been taking a while to fall alseep I wake up feeling rested anyway Some thoughts I will continue with this technique because I haven't had much luck with the other techniques and my dream recall has been rather bad lately, and SSILD has improved that, It strange how this technique works and I notice how it's described as "setting off a time bomb, to go off in your dream" in the updated guide I don't really understand that quote and was hoping for some clearification, but I do believe this could be a great helping hand technique for beginners and I appreciate any input or advice from fellow SSILDers Thanks, -EmptyBucket -------- SSILD is sort of a hybrid of WILD and DILD techniques. I say that because it is possible for it to cause both types of dreams to happen. However, to use SSILD more effectively we should lean more on the DILD side, and treat WILD as solely a side effect. Now for DILD to happen of course we need to be dreaming/sleeping first. Thus the most important part of SSILD really is how quickly you can fall asleep after performing the exercise. The more quickly you fall asleep, the higher chance you will have at getting a DILD, FA, or suddenly awaken into an OBE (I hate to use this word but I'm now banned to use the other word I preferred, LOL). Of course there is no guarantee that SSILD will give you a DILD, but at least if you do it right it won't take you too long and you will have many more nights to try. On the other hand if you try too hard and end up not being able to sleep, then you will miss the opportunity of getting a DILD as well as precious sleep! For people who are just starting with this the hardest thing to do is not the technique itself, but "letting go". Having said all that, I want to add that SSILD is actually not a hit or miss type of technique once you learn it. It is almost guaranteed that after you do it you will run into some sort of FA or semi-FAs which you can utilize to turn into full blown LD experiences. Once you master this part it can give you near 100% success rate. I hope this helps. Cheers.

Originally Posted by gab: What do you know. What you are accusing cosmic iron from doing, you are doing yourself. This is a quote from your post, summerlander, from website I will not name. Simple search of the phrase will show anybody interested where it comes from. -------- You don't you say "I use the word 'phase' invented by Raduga." You say you call it that way. So what gives? And technically, yes, you did follow cosmic iron here. He joined in august and you in october. -------- Thank you gab. BTW, I did not join in August. In fact I had been on this forum for many more years but after I registered this account my other one got banned and deleted, LOL.

So I tried this a couple of months ago for a couple of weeks, but was more using it as a meditation to get to sleep quickly, which seemed to work I think, but I looked over it again a few days ago and have been using it the last two nights. I haven't got lucidyet, and have run into a couple of problems/questions. How do I know if I'm concentrating or focusing on my closed eyelids, or if I'm looking at the blackness created by my mind? Or does it matter, along as I'm focusing othe visual? Next, I don't seem very adept at switching between the cycles, which is strange in itself, as I usually wouldn't have a problem doing that... Does it matter tht it might take a few seconds to stop thinking about the visual, once I've told myself to start thinking about the audio? And connected to this, I still hear the audio when and see th visual etc when performing the other cycles... Is that's problem?. And finally, when doing it upon waking I tend to get distracted very easily I think, by all the images and the dreamless that form. I do catch Myself and tell myself to return to the start ofthe cycle that I was in, but then Id get distracted easily again. Should I be waking myself up more in this case... And connected, is it a problem to fall asleep while doing the cycles, I did last night I think... From what I can gather this is something akin to a MILD technique, whic wouldn't matter if I fell asleep, but you seem adamant that one should finish the cycles and then sleep and that one shouldnt be doing any other methods with this(is this just during the sleep process, or does that extend to awareness etc during the day?) Sorry, there was more than I thought, thanks for the tech, it does seem very promising to me. Once I smooth out a few kinks that is

Originally Posted by LittleStar: How do I know if I'm concentrating or focusing on my closed eyelids, or if I'm looking at the blackness created by my mind? Or does it matter, along as I'm focusing othe visual? -------- Both are okay, actually. The only problem with the former is that you may end up causing a lot of stress to your eye muscle and become unable to sleep. To be able to use SSILD effectively, one really needs to understand the design philosophy behind it -- Lucid dream induction is largely a mental exercise, and therefore is rather delicate. Very subtle differences in what you do and the conditions can cause dramatic differences in the outcomes. SSILD was designed to minimize this issue. Instead of requiring a lot of finesse from the users, it goes the opposite, asking the users to perform each step without too much concern and effort. Basically, just DO it without thinking too much. I find that people who have difficulty with SSILD are usually the analytical type -- they tend to analyze too much, thus bringing in too much rational thoughts and discipline into the process. SSILD aims to be a "technique", not "art". Thus, you should really do the same. In Chinese we have a saying "Little monk reads sutras without heart, just the mouth." Now to do SSILD properly we need exactly that! LOL. So basically, it doesn't matter whether you are focusing or staring. Just do it! Better yet, do it without putting in too much effort. Originally Posted by LittleStar: Next, I don't seem very adept at switching between the cycles -------- Again, it's perfectly fine. In fact it is often a good sign. When this happens it means you are getting close to falling asleep. Just try to finish the required four sets and you are done. Don't worry if you got the orders wrong, or there are moments you completely blacked out. It's fine to get those senses overlapped too. I do that all the time. About the distraction you mentioned upon waking... I'm not sure I understand it correctly. Do you mean you see things while doing the exercise? If that's the case then you are encountering hypnagogia which is great! It means you are drifting into dreams while still being conscious. If they do get intense then just stop cycling and do an RC. Chances are you are already in a dream. Falling asleep while doing the exercise is okay too, but if fall asleep too quickly then you may not have warmed it up sufficiently for things to occur later. I suggest that you at least finish the 4 sets. If that becomes difficult then it's a sign you have not had sufficient sleep prior to that. In this case you should rest well before attempting the exercise. As for comparing to MILD, no, I'd say it is completely different. MILD, IMO, is almost exactly the opposite of SSILD. It is exactly the kind of problem SSILD tries to solve -- delicate mental exercise. In SSILD, you do NOT need any type of autosuggestions, visualizations, imaging things, etc. Just do the steps in the dumbest fashion and it will work! Do the opposite, you might as well go with the other techniques. I don't recommend mixing other techniques during SSILD, and I don't recommend stuff like meditation prior to doing SSILD. Those exercises are designed to put your mind into a specific state, which may not be optimal as a launching pad for SSILD. Stuff you do during the day doesn't really matter, for example, ADA. However, I'm always skeptical of their effectiveness... but that's another subject. I hope this helps. Good luck!

Thanks forthe quick reply, and thanks for clarifying. As you have identified, i am a very analytical person, but I attempted this again, with my new 'dont think about it' stance. Unfortunately, I don't know if I was too awake to begin with, but thoughts were popping into my head, my 'active brain' kicked in, there were conversations and songs and scenarios for all sorts of things playing in my head, which prevented me from falling asleep again, so I had to wake up at 4.30am:/ These were the distractions I was talking about, I find it very difficult to quiet them down, and it's frustrating when the only advice you can find online is, 'just let these thoughts pass by' lol. When I wake in the night I do quiet often experience what I think is hypnagogia, basically just a short dream that plays in the darkness behind my eyes, almost more audio thatn visual, and I'm fully aware I'm awake during. They rarely get vivid enough to warrant an RC, and i think a problem is that they arent about me, usually just a wierd conversation between to characters, so even if i did get into a lucid situation from them, i wouldnt be there to do an RC... If that makes any sense. Should I be attempting perhaps to cultivate is dreamlet into a more personal thing, involving me doing something and eventually into a lucid, or is that getting into WILD territory lol. Thanks again, I'm fairly convinced about the technique after reading all the success stories and am happy thinking that it will work for me, I just need to get over the hurdle first

Stuff you do during the day doesn't really matter, for example, ADA. However, I'm always skeptical of their effectiveness... but that's another subject. -------- Why are you skeptical? (Feel free to reply in private or start another thread if you don't want to go off topic too much.)

Originally Posted by LittleStar: Thanks forthe quick reply, and thanks for clarifying. As you have identified, i am a very analytical person... -------- I will add a question for CosmicIron...perhaps for both of us. I know we aren't really supposed to mix techniques until we are proficient at the technique, but when we have an overly active mind, don't we need to take 10 seconds or so to clear our mind with some other method? I have one that doesn't require thinking beyond the initial decision to do it. I will leave it to CosmicIron to respond to your questions but I wanted to let you know that you weren't alone. I too am very analytical much of the time - and overly analytical too often. With practice (mostly just time) I have been able to make the cycles work for me though and I attribute the technique to providing most of my LDs so far. I am still working at it though on weekends and maybe once during the work week. More good news is that those thoughts popping into your mind are signs that you mind is getting ready to drift off to sleep. For analytical people, we have to find a way to not pay attention to those dreamlets unless you are trying to WILD perhaps(not my suit yet). I like to pay attention to those dreamlets because they are so fascinating to me as to where in the heck they come from, but we must resist if we want to fall asleep and let the "time bomb" go off later in the night in the middle of one of your dreams...and to me that is one of the most fascinating things about the technique...the seemingly spontaneous DILDs (though I have had what I think were a few WILDS when I didn't fall asleep quickly and one DEILD I attribute to the technique).

Originally Posted by Bobblehat: Why are you skeptical? (Feel free to reply in private or start another thread if you don't want to go off topic too much.) --------: I, too, would also be interested in this reply. You have your audience, CosmicIron, please share your thoughts.

Originally Posted by Bobblehat: Why are you skeptical? (Feel free to reply in private or start another thread if you don't want to go off topic too much.) -------- Both from experience and observation. Recently we conducted a survey on our forum among more than 400 volunteers. Part of the survey is to compare how well some of the well-known techniques worked. The result is not favorable to ADA and similar techniques. The survey is by no means well designed and its very possible the result is erroneous. However I believe it does offer some useful references on this subject. I will not get into details here because I don't want to start a flame war. Your welcome to write me in private if you wish to discuss this subject.

Originally Posted by fogelbise: I will add a question for CosmicIron...perhaps for both of us. I know we aren't really supposed to mix techniques until we are proficient at the technique, but when we have an overly active mind, don't we need to take 10 seconds or so to clear our mind with some other method? I have one that doesn't require thinking beyond the initial decision to do it. I will leave it to CosmicIron to respond to your questions but I wanted to let you know that you weren't alone. I too am very analytical much of the time - and overly analytical too often. With practice (mostly just time) I have been able to make the cycles work for me though and I attribute the technique to providing most of my LDs so far. I am still working at it though on weekends and maybe once during the work week. More good news is that those thoughts popping into your mind are signs that you mind is getting ready to drift off to sleep. For analytical people, we have to find a way to not pay attention to those dreamlets unless you are trying to WILD perhaps(not my suit yet). I like to pay attention to those dreamlets because they are so fascinating to me as to where in the heck they come from, but we must resist if we want to fall asleep and let the "time bomb" go off later in the night in the middle of one of your dreams...and to me that is one of the most fascinating things about the technique...the seemingly spontaneous DILDs (though I have had what I think were a few WILDS when I didn't fall asleep quickly and one DEILD I attribute to the technique). -------- This is so well put I have nothing more to add! I will redirect my answer to your post instead.

CosmicIron: Are you just referring to ADA, as you keep mentioning that, or any daytime practice? I ask because I've been meaning to start a thread that asks if maybe ADA is no help at all to LD'ing, and may even have negative effect, but had no interest in starting another "flame war" myself.... also I ask because I'm curious... Sorry to not ask this in a PM, but it seems enough people are interested to risk another break from your thread.

Originally Posted by fogelbise: I will add a question for CosmicIron...perhaps for both of us. I know we aren't really supposed to mix techniques until we are proficient at the technique, but when we have an overly active mind, don't we need to take 10 seconds or so to clear our mind with some other method? I have one that doesn't require thinking beyond the initial decision to do it. I will leave it to CosmicIron to respond to your questions but I wanted to let you know that you weren't alone. I too am very analytical much of the time - and overly analytical too often. With practice (mostly just time) I have been able to make the cycles work for me though and I attribute the technique to providing most of my LDs so far. I am still working at it though on weekends and maybe once during the work week. More good news is that those thoughts popping into your mind are signs that you mind is getting ready to drift off to sleep. For analytical people, we have to find a way to not pay attention to those dreamlets unless you are trying to WILD perhaps(not my suit yet). I like to pay attention to those dreamlets because they are so fascinating to me as to where in the heck they come from, but we must resist if we want to fall asleep and let the "time bomb" go off later in the night in the middle of one of your dreams...and to me that is one of the most fascinating things about the technique...the seemingly spontaneous DILDs (though I have had what I think were a few WILDS when I didn't fall asleep quickly and one DEILD I attribute to the technique). -------- There are distinctions between active mind and those "dreamlets" (I love this word). The later, as you put it, is actually a good thing so there is no need to battle them. The former one though, is a major problem because it can keep you awake. I find that the more practice you have with SSILD, the more likely the cycles will help you quiet down those active thoughts so they are themselves instruments to help you relax. This, however, seems only true to people who have become used to the technique, not beginners. I still wouldn't advise mixing other techniques though because the state of our mind can be influenced by very subtle things. Therefore introducing extra ingredients may create dramatically different conditions. Who knows, they could be better than the one from SSILD, but for people who are just starting I'd advise against doing it. For those who are proficient with SSILD that's a different story of course. Experiment however you like and if you find a more effective combo by all means please let me know so we can improve this technique!

Originally Posted by Sageous: CosmicIron: Are you just referring to ADA, as you keep mentioning that, or any daytime practice? I ask because I've been meaning to start a thread that asks if maybe ADA is no help at all to LD'ing, and may even have negative effect, but had no interest in starting another "flame war" myself.... also I ask because I'm curious... Sorry to not ask this in a PM, but it seems enough people are interested to risk another break from your thread. -------- I'm referring to both actually, but in particular ADA because it is often seen by many as the "ultimate" so there are some really high expectations. One analogy I always like to use is the Jason Bourne story. In the first Bourne movie he demonstrated a very high level of awareness of his surroundings. I don't know if spies are really trained to be like that but if they are, then according to the ADA theory we will have many lucid dream masters among them. LOL.

I didn't realize ssild required practice and time to perfect, it seems really straightforward to me. Whats the difference between a novice and experienced ssild-er? edit: does it usually take a bunch of repeated efforts before lucidity starts showing up? like a couple weeks of doing ssild with wbtb every night or something?

Originally Posted by tofur: I didn't realize ssild required practice and time to perfect, it seems really straightforward to me. Whats the difference between a novice and experienced ssild-er? edit: does it usually take a bunch of repeated efforts before lucidity starts showing up? like a couple weeks of doing ssild with wbtb every night or something? -------- Both questions I'm sure CosmicIron can give you a much better answer on but I will say that on your second question in the edit: I have seen many accounts of people gaining lucidity within the first week of using the technique and some others that were struggling to get it to work. It seems to have a high early success rate...then again, maybe many people that have trouble with it do not post anything unless they are willing to ask for help. Part 2 Originally Posted by Sageous: CosmicIron: Are you just referring to ADA, as you keep mentioning that, or any daytime practice? I ask because I've been meaning to start a thread that asks if maybe ADA is no help at all to LD'ing, and may even have negative effect, but had no interest in starting another "flame war" myself.... also I ask because I'm curious... Sorry to not ask this in a PM, but it seems enough people are interested to risk another break from your thread. -------- I don't know about ADA, and I see CosmicIron's response doubting both to some degree, but I definitely feel there is a place for some types of daily practice according to various accounts all over these forums. It would be good to know if there are certain practices that do more harm than good though. Sounds like a poll and/or a thread would be a good way to determine if certain practices have very few people standing behind them through their first hand experience or belief that the practice was important in their lucid dreaming journey.

Originally Posted by Sageous: CosmicIron: Are you just referring to ADA, as you keep mentioning that, or any daytime practice? I ask because I've been meaning to start a thread that asks if maybe ADA is no help at all to LD'ing, and may even have negative effect, but had no interest in starting another "flame war" myself.... also I ask because I'm curious... Sorry to not ask this in a PM, but it seems enough people are interested to risk another break from your thread. -------- I would also be very interested in such a thread. I am not sure if by all day awareness you are referring to the Yoga/Buddhist practice of mindfulness (I will read the tutorial now) but I have found the variation of Dream Yoga in moderate doses to be very beneficial. It would be interesting to get more viewpoints on the subject of awareness; as there are many types of awareness, some more beneficial than others, and some are beneficial in very different ways.

Well, I've been trying this for around a week now Results -No lucids -No false awakenings(at least I think?) -Dream recall is great(very happy about this) My style So sometimes when attempting techniques to induce LDs I'm either very excited to attempt it, but other times when doing techniques I'm kind of just in a "whatever" mindset(ie, it would be cool to have a lucid tonight but if not.. meh), It would be helpful if someone could tell me which mindset is most resourceful for lucid dreaming as I know mindsets are HUGE in success. But latey I've been waking up, doing the cycles somewhat carelessly and sometimes extremely carelessly, just kind of messing around with that. Every morning I wake up and I remember my dreams and it's starting to get rare that I remember nothing(which is awesome). Although, I've been having some moments where I feel like when I was in the dream I could've done something, like I was 1/4 conscious. Very hard to explain it just feels like the day following the dream I felt like I was close enough to attain lucidity. Some thoughts I enjoy doing this method but I'm hungering to attempt other methods such as WILD, but at the same time I feel like I should stick to this method as it's yielding better results than I've had with WILD, DILD(had 2 short lucid, idk bout this one). But I feel like this can also be a good stepping stone for beginners to increase recall and I would recommend this method to people with bad recall.

just had a lengthy lucid and a FA via ssild last night. I'd say this was my 9th or 10th attempt, I was starting to have doubts. The FA was weird, the dream blacked out and I was "awake", but felt fuzzy. I plugged my nose and tried to breathe and it worked, I did it a few more times because it didn't make any sense, but then I like, forgot about it or something. Maybe the issue was I never opened my eyes. Weird. Lucidity wasn't as clear as it could've been. This is where I'm also curious as to the benefit of awareness practice. Can it lead to increased awareness once your lucid in a dream, is that a potential use for it? what do you guys do to increase your "waking consciousness" once you realize your dreaming?

Well, of course after I mention my no results I have a lucid, was very short in length but I was like jumping in and out of the lucid it was very weird. Like I kept losing lucidity and then regaining it. I'm going to say it was a mix between SSILD and DEILD? I say this because I did the cycles, went through another cycle of REM then woke up before the next cycle, then had the dream. either way, if you want to read it, go for it. 6-14-2013 - Psycho Murder Accident and Owen Wilson - Dream Journals - Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views

So, I have to assume that either this the doesn't work for me, or wasnt doing it right. I tried it for 4-5 days, I know it's not the lengthiest spell, but my recall in those days went down to near nothing, really just a vague image or two each night rather than any kind of full dream. I switched back to MILD with my usual mantras and mediation before sleep and immediately had much better recall. I am inclined to think that I just fail at SSILD, as so many people can't be wrong about the tech, but I think for me I needed the mantra to focus on dreaming before sleeping, rather than focusing in external factors. As some above posts suggest, it could be that I need to press through until I become a little more used to a different kind focusing, or perhaps need to return to this once I'm a little more proficient and experienced with lucidity in general. (as a side note, I dont seem to ever get that initial jolt of lucidity with a new and interesting tech that many people seem to get, perhaps I'm too analytical for that, or pessimistic(realistic), but that I would say is a big problem for me and new methods... Just not sure how to overcome it, and set my mind up for decent expectation of lucidity.) A quick point about the ADA, isn't want the thread to be hijacked by any means, but I would be interested in a thread about this, as I'm in the mind that ADA is the perfect tech, it makes sense to me that it should work, and I think I would attribute a lot of my lucid dreams to general awareness rather than a technique... In fact probably all (2 or 3) that weren't induced by fear. I would be very interested to hear other opinions and arguments, especially if there was experience fro the likes of Sageous weighing on the counter.

Originally Posted by LittleStar: So, I have to assume that either this the doesn't work for me, or wasnt doing it right. I tried it for 4-5 days, I know it's not the lengthiest spell, but my recall in those days went down to near nothing, really just a vague image or two each night rather than any kind of full dream. I switched back to MILD with my usual mantras and mediation before sleep and immediately had much better recall. I am inclined to think that I just fail at SSILD, as so many people can't be wrong about the tech, but I think for me I needed the mantra to focus on dreaming before sleeping, rather than focusing in external factors. As some above posts suggest, it could be that I need to press through until I become a little more used to a different kind focusing, or perhaps need to return to this once I'm a little more proficient and experienced with lucidity in general. (as a side note, I dont seem to ever get that initial jolt of lucidity with a new and interesting tech that many people seem to get, perhaps I'm too analytical for that, or pessimistic(realistic), but that I would say is a big problem for me and new methods... Just not sure how to overcome it, and set my mind up for decent expectation of lucidity.) A quick point about the ADA, isn't want the thread to be hijacked by any means, but I would be interested in a thread about this, as I'm in the mind that ADA is the perfect tech, it makes sense to me that it should work, and I think I would attribute a lot of my lucid dreams to general awareness rather than a technique... In fact probably all (2 or 3) that weren't induced by fear. I would be very interested to hear other opinions and arguments, especially if there was experience fro the likes of Sageous weighing on the counter. -------- dude just chill with the negative talk, I just had my first lucid from ssild and it took like 10 nights to get it. My recall went down too some nights, and was really good some other nights. I think there is some subtly to it, even though it is really straightforward, but I'd love to hear cosmiciron's opinion on that.

Originally Posted by tofur: dude just chill with the negative talk, I just had my first lucid from ssild and it took like 10 nights to get it. My recall went down too some nights, and was really good some other nights. I think there is some subtly to it, even though it is really straightforward, but I'd love to hear cosmiciron's opinion on that. --------: Oh no, I didn't mean to sound negative I was merely saying that I think I found it more difficult than other methods, and I think the lack of concentration used for the cycles is the problem. I have a very narrow line between sleeping and wide awake. So I either wake up to much and my brain noise kicks in, so I don't sleep, or I fall asleep before the cycles are finished. It just going to take time to find the right balance between everything, and I think until I've found this median other methods ight be a little easier for me... That said,it could well be that I didn't give this enough time. I think ill have a break for a week or so, then try again, if I get the same results then I'll know a little more. All about experimentation at this point in time for me

Originally Posted by tofur: I didn't realize ssild required practice and time to perfect, it seems really straightforward to me. Whats the difference between a novice and experienced ssild-er? edit: does it usually take a bunch of repeated efforts before lucidity starts showing up? like a couple weeks of doing ssild with wbtb every night or something? -------- Some people saw success on the first try, and some simply never get it. As much as I wanted SSILD to be idiot-proof it is still far from reaching that goal. With more practice, one can indeed increase the success rate of SSILD. The amount of effort required also decrease as one becomes more proficient.