Lding Is Not Supernatural, There Are No Shadow Men. Its Jus

Actually lucid dreaming is whatever you believe and that's what you are going to get when you have them. And if someone has some spiritual lucid dream that actually helps them and heals them or whatever it is in fact real to that person. Just not real to you because your thoughts and beliefs are different.

You are suggesting that a lucid dream is whatever you believe? That is hog-wash. Okay, then, I believe you are flamingo... Now tell me, are you sprouting pink feathers yet? I did not think so. Lucid dream can form anything you want, but a lucid dream is a phenomena, and one with a likely rational explanation, you cant just make up things and pretend its true just because you want, and then get upset when someone points out that your explanation is clearly defying the evidence and logic of reality.

People really need to experience it more, first hand. You won't know water better than a fish, unless you become one yourselves, LOL. Interestingly though, you actually do achieve more LDs if you follow a more systematic and scientific path! I personally agree with OP. There are more benefits to be gained if one approaches lucid dreaming scientifically. Associating lucid dreams with religious or spiritual meanings, I won't say it's right or wrong, but it does make one more prone to the trickery of the subconscious mind.

I agree with you that this all involves a biological, scientific method to make but it never stopped me from having a spiritual feeling towards it anyways. I don't look at something like ice cream, and not have a wonderful feeling towards it based on it's science, I have a wonderful, god thanking feeling because it's scientifically possible. I don't outright believe in magic, but I do believe with proper, logical processes, we can achieve something just as amazing.

It's interesting you sound so sure of yourself. I'm curious though how you can explain a dream story being played out. Also you generically say your mind makes hypnotic images which is true, but obviously we all have various parts of our mind. It's been established that the subconscious part of our mind creates this imagery and experiences. Can you explain it's process, or reason to create specific images, or do you think it's just random. If it is random how can some dreams be so clear and detailed? I'm 30 and have been LDing for as long as I can remember. I obviously have my own opinions on the matter, but I'd like a different perspective from you since you are very sure. I'd also like to know how you came to these conclusions. Did you perform any standardized tests?

Hey man, I've been reading this whole thread and I feel bad for you because none of these other comments are being fair. But hey man, I understand where you're coming from, and you're right. However, you can't reason someone out of a position that they didn't reason themselves into in the first place! Don't let them keep you down bro, stay rational

Well I would suppose we would need to discuss what your definition is of a spiritual thing. If you don't believe spirituality is a something that exists, and if you are a material reductionist, then sleeping and waking life are neither spiritual things. Conversely, you could suppose that spiritual things can and do happen while we wake but dreams only represent a biological process being enacted. If spiritual experiences are possible in the world, and yours and my definition of what that means are close enough to each other, then we can have a meaningful discussion about what actually constitutes reality to our brains and minds. On the other hand, if you do not believe spiritual experiences are things that actually exist in the world, or what you mean by spiritual experiences is vastly different than what I mean, then we can have no meaningful discussion on this topic. I have had spiritual experiences while lucid dreaming that defy explanation and could not been possible in waking life. Can this be proven scientifically; no, as nothing truly spiritual can. If you have been lucid dreaming for ten plus years, I have a very difficult time accepting that nothing spiritual has happened to you in that time period.

There is some kind of fallacy presented here. You write "it's just biology and science" as if dreaming is understood by science, but it is not. Knowing the outward effects of dreaming is different than knowing why our brain dreams, or what determines the contents. Let alone the biology of lucid dreaming. As far as I'm concerned lucid dreaming is one of the biggest challenges to modern consciousness theory and there is no way you can call this straight science.

I'm here to read about lucid dreaming. Not atheistic rants. If I would enjoy debating an atheist, I would head over to /r/DebateAnAtheist. Is it that boring over there that you try to discuss atheism here? In all honesty, I don't enjoy it that much. Especially not the missionary kind. From a psychological point of view, this seems to be more about basking in the light of a self-perceived intellectual superiority than anything else. Expect what you want, and find laughable what you want. Bluntly put, I couldn't care less.

I thoroughly agree with this, it's like being afraid of the dark. Of coursge any rational adult knows that there is nothing to be afraid of, but when you're walking in a dark room, you are the man who walks alone. I know there isn't actually a someone waiting somewhere outside my window, but goddamn it, that knocking is far too rythmic and insistent to be my imagination...

You realise biology was once upon a time philosophy? It is all still based on theories and ideas and is only considered a science because experiments were performed to validate certain claims. It is still every bit magic we only have fancy science terms to back up what we know but at the end of the day, what we know is all just made up by people like you and I.